10 LED sequencer using 4017 counter

[seanyiya]

what do you want the chaser to do, once it's reached full on?

if you want a "bargraph" where you start with 1 led and work up to N leds, then you need a different chip ... there is another inexpensive bargraph driver IC that may do just what you're asking.  That is going to be the LM391x family, there's a few options, I don't know what they're for exactly.

I don't know enough about the analog world to be more help ... in the digital world, it'd take only a few min to code up what you want... but then there's the expense of a ic programmer and all that jazz.

It's gona be used as turn signal, so it will turn off at the end of the cycle... and starts over when the turn signal turns on again... that's all it has to do....

LM3916 sounds interesting, but doesn't it requires certain range of signal input to make the bar go up and down...

I would love to microcontroller, but I don't know anything about programming..... 

[justDIY]

that same 555 you have which makes your 4017 count, can also be configured as a "ramp generator".

the ramp generator will build up voltage over time, and then a sharp dropoff at the end of the ramp

you feed this ramp into the lm3916, which is basically just a volt meter.   as the ramp builds higher, more leds come on (in bargraph mode) until the 555 reaches the end of the ramp, and the voltage falls back to 0

best how-to I could find:
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_6/chpt_6/8.html

datasheet:
http://www.national.com/ds.cgi/LM/LM555.pdf

[seanyiya]

Thanks.. I'll study those parts...

But I've found something intesting....
Searching through the internet about 4017 this pin out said "Latch Enable" which usually say "Clock Enable" from mother other sites
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4017_IC

Would I be able to use that 13 pin some how to keep them latched like this from the diagram??
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b284/seanyiya/New%20LED%20Tail%20Light%20Retro/Timing-Dig.gif

[justDIY]

as I read it, clock/latch enable and carry work together, to allow the counters to be arrayed, for counting numbers larger than 10

but, the best cure for "what does something do" is to try it out on the the breadboard

the bargraph driver is going to be your quickest solution ... since you essentially want to make a bargraph out of your tail lights.

[seanyiya]

as I read it, clock/latch enable and carry work together, to allow the counters to be arrayed, for counting numbers larger than 10

but, the best cure for "what does something do" is to try it out on the the breadboard

the bargraph driver is going to be your quickest solution ... since you essentially want to make a bargraph out of your tail lights.

Do you think you can draw up a simple diagram for this??
I'm lost now with the bargraph driver....

[justDIY]

in my, perhaps narrow minded point of view, there's nothing simple about analog ... so many variables and discrete components to make things work the way you want, especially if you want some variety.

I'm working on a simple design for you, it involves 3 ICs (well 4 if you count the vreg as an ic)... I need to work on it a bit more and then i'll post some diagrams.

this LED sequencer is powered by a small and cheap (less than $2) PIC microcontroller, and can sequence as many LEDs as you have patience to solder up.   I've drawn it with 8 strings of six LEDs, with an optional group handling another 8 strings of six LEDs... you can daisy chain as many chips and LEDs as you want to, I think the practical limit is 15 groups before you max out the current the microcontroller can output.

I was hoping one of the analog guru's would jump in and give you some guidance, as I don't have any experience with the 555, the LM3914 or even the 4017, other than what I read online or in the data sheets.  I dove straight into digital and never looked back!

[seanyiya]

Thanks alot....
I'm already overwhelmed with the all this analog type of circuitry...
I can put together circuit from diagram, but I don't know how to make my own...

Microcontroller is something I can't touch.... 
So with this microcontroller... it can power all that LED??
8 string with 6 LED... so 48 LED... x 15 group... that's alot of LED...
Does it uses like Gate(transistor)?? kind of lost...

No one said anything about analog setup....

Well.. if worst comes to worst.. I'll start learning the microcontroller... but I really don't want to since I hate programming.....

[justDIY]

here is some more to overwhelm .... hehe, I just like to draw with this cad program too much


(click for huge version)

here is the basic idea

IC1 (PIC 12F635 or 12F683) is the PIC microcontroller ... it's a handy little dude, 8 pins, 1 to 2k of ram, usually under $2 bucks.
IC2 (74HC595) is a series shift register ... think of it as 8 switches the pic can turn on and off, usually under $0.50 cents
IC3 (ULN2803) is a darlington array ... it is no different than 8 regular NPN transistors, they're just all wired together inside a handy small package, usually under a buck

So, the PIC is programmed with various sequence patterns, _exactly_ like the 1's and 0's you described before ... using whatever delay you choose, the PIC hammers those 1's and 0's out to the shift register.   The register accordingly turns its 8 switches on and off ... 1 is on, 0 is off.  The darlington array is needed because the shift register cannot handle the 12v from the car electrical system... it also gives you the ability to switch rather large loads (up to 1/2 amp PER output).  In order to expand this setup to handle more than 8 strings (10, 16, 100, etc), you just add more shift registers (and darlingtons) ... the registers diasychain, making it very easy to connect them.  In the PIC, you just add more 1's and 0's to your patterns ... 8 led strings is 8 bits (1's and 0's), 16 strings = 16 bits, and so on.

Since each string is represented by a bit, you can arrange your patterns however you want ... left to right, right to left, center out, outside in ... lets see those analog guys do all that, with only 2 chips!

I know you don't want to get into microcontrollers ... learning the programming does suck

Other than that, all I can recommend is grab a few bargraph drivers (lm3914 is linear, lm3916 is logarithmic) and start experimenting

edit: added part numbers for the ICs

[justDIY]

hey seanyiya, here is another thought

there are things called picaxe and basic stamp, which are both PIC microcontroller (and thus would work in this circuit), they are both programmed with simple basic, but the real key is, they both accept programming from a simple serial cable, so no programmer to buy or build.

http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/picaxe/
http://www.parallax.com/

[seanyiya]

 

I'm speechless... but
I'll try to put together that circuit board first...
I have to put my foot in to the door.... 

Thanks for the diagram....

[seanyiya]

Couple of question.... 

IC6 would be the 12v Voltage Regulator..

What is IC5P and IC2P??
Also what connects to Vdd??
and what is 10R resistor??

My car outputs about 13.6-14.2volt (idle/running)
Does the input HAS to be 12v??

Sorry for noob questions....
Thanks alot

[justDIY]

IC6 would be the 12v Voltage Regulator..

correct IC6 is a LM7805 or 78L05 regulator ... only needs to supply a few 10's of mA for the logic circuits

What is IC5P and IC2P??
Also what connects to Vdd??

those are power connections for IC5 and IC2 (the shift registers) ... in this schematic, Vcc and Vdd both = +5 vdc and Vss = Gnd
so anywhere you see a Vcc or Vdd it means, connect +5vdc here ... anywhere you see gnd or vss it means connect ground here

and what is 10R resistor??

it means 10 ohms ... it's one method of notation for resistance on schematics ... you'll sometimes see 4R7 for 4.7 ohms or 4K7 for 4700 ohms

My car outputs about 13.6-14.2volt (idle/running)
Does the input HAS to be 12v??

whatever the voltage is, it doesn't matter ... there wasn't a symbol for 13.6 volts, so I just went with 12 ... I suppose it could be label Vbatt or something like that ... getting back to the 10R and for that matter, the LEDs ... you don't have to use 6 leds, or a 10 ohm resistor, those are just examples ... use whatever LED configuration you want to - this circuit is super flexible... you can use any LED up to 500mA for each string ... and LEDs in series add voltage, not current, so one 350ma luxeon takes the same current as four in series... the four just take a higher voltage

[seanyiya]

Thanks alot.. that helps alot.... still little bit of pondering to do... 

So after I put all of them together.. next is programming??
I would need a programing device and connect to my computer then program it

[MattMc]

I just found this forum and this thread in particular caught my interest. What a great discussion!

seanyiya: Hopefully I didn't miss a link somewhere showing what you wanted your LED sequence to look like. Is this what you are describing?




Matt

[justDIY]

So after I put all of them together.. next is programming??
I would need a programing device and connect to my computer then program it

right - i should point out ... that circuit looks overwhelming perhaps, but once you get it on a breadboard, you'll see it is very simple... I think part of what makes it look nasty are all those leds - but you've already got your LEDs built, so no problem there!  Really, there are just three connections to make between the two (or three) chips, and then power and ground for each chip ... then you can work with it just using a single LED for now, and when you're ready, add the transistors (IC3 and IC4) and connect in to your large led arrays.

hardware:
for the "raw" pic (not picaxe / stamp), you can build a programmer for under $5 or buy one for under $20
for the picaxe (and the stamp), you just need a serial cable and a 5v power supply, it is self programming

software:
for the "raw" pic, you need a compiler and an assembler ... I use software called Proton Development Suite, but there are a lot to choose from ... generally, the easier it is to use, the more it costs 

for the picaxe, you need the free software they have on their website.

for the basic stamp, it has an onboard interpreter which translates basic code directly into machine code, so you just write your basic in whatever editor you want, and upload it to the stamp